At times over the past fortnight I've felt variously like a one-man consumer pressure group, a spoiled crybaby, and Anne Robinson. None of these is a good thing. But that's what #rimlag has reduced me too. That's the, let's be honest, pretty unpleasant term which I've coined to describe the debilitating framerate problems that have dogged some* PS3 players experience of the otherwise utterly superb Skyrim.
(*I'm dutybound to say 'some', because it doesn't affect all players - older machines with rammed HDDs seem particularly susceptible. Though a straw poll of the office/my Twitter feed suggests the problem is commonplace. As does even a cursory glance at the Bethesda PS3 Skyrim support forum, where threads like this one first highlighted the issue.)
Not exactly, no.
Amongst other fixes, the funniest of which has to be an "occasional issue where a guest would arrive to the player's wedding dead", (don't mind Kenneth, he always smells like that), the patch promised to improve "occasional performance issues resulting from long term play". Hmm. We'll ignore the arse-covering "occasional", shall we?
Hardened followers of the #rimlag debacle will remember that pre-patch, my game (11mb save, lvl 41 character, 70+hours play, really sweet armour) would eventually deteriorate to flipbook levels of performance, necessitating a restart to (albeit temporarily) cure the problem.
Having installed the 92mb Band-Aid yesterday, my initial response was overwhelmingly positive.
Initially, I was startled by how buttery smooth the framerate seemed having installed the patch. It even held up fine when going into problem areas crowded with NPCs, such as Whiterun, or engaging in large scale scraps with multiple enemies out in the wild. I was a happy Sabre Cat. However, extended play later last night - and we're talking a three hour session - saw the choppiness creep back in, until eventually it became unplayable again.
Pay another visit to the Bethesda forum and you'll find all manner of gripes and grizzles, from fatal crashes to janky magic resistance. Bizarrely, some folk are more lucky, like Official PlayStation Magazine's Leon Hurley, who suddenly finds himself with horse.
Comments
55 comments so far...
TheCrimsonFenix on 29 Nov '11 said:
To be entirely honest, I didn't expect anything more from Bethesda.
El Mag on 29 Nov '11 said:
We can understand your pain Tim....let's go fly fishing.
budge on 29 Nov '11 said:
I knew this patch wouldn't fix the PS3 lag, that's why i made the trade for an Xbox copy. I really do feel for those unlucky majority.
Bethesda are wack but seem to make cracking games.
AJDarkstar on 29 Nov '11 said:
I told a mate that it'd be a miracle if it was shipped without game-killing glitches.... most predictable problem ever.
versionr on 29 Nov '11 said:
When the Bethesda boys did their speed run, did they do it on xbox/pc? Or did they do it on PS3 and would have got it under 2 hours if it wasn't for the lag?
flash501 on 29 Nov '11 said:
As soon as I saw that they had said "improved" the problems with long term play, I knew it was still going to be an issue.
I don't want it improved, I bloody want it fixed!!!
RichPerry on 29 Nov '11 said:
Ugh, I wish I had known about all this before I shelled out for my PS3 copy. All of these lag issues started coming to light the day after I started playing. Mercifully I haven't noticed much in the way of lag, but I'm fearful that the more I play I'm trreading further and further into danger country.
Unfortunately, the more I play also makes me less inclined to trade in for an XBox copy, because I don't want to lose all my progress. Arg, highly frustrating, and Bethesda must sort this out.
Cogglesz on 29 Nov '11 said:
Thats a damn shame, i really feel sorry for Tim Clark and all the other people going through this on the PS3, i must admit i had a rather bad time with NV on the PS3 and i was really, really looking forward to that game, so much that i pre-ordered the limited edition on PS3 for like £90, (fallout 3 is like one of my all time favourites) but it looked and ran horrible and i was really let down with it, happily i've got a good pc now and new vegas runs and looks a hell of a lot better, but i hope skyrim can be fixed of this bad bug, i'm actually getting a bit paranoid that when i get up to those kind of hours on skyrim even my pc is going to suffer for it in similar ways.
Flamestrike on 29 Nov '11 said:
I guess I fall into the 'some' category not experiencing any major issues. Has this something to do with owning a 40g PS3?
Reason I ask is that people I've spoken to who have experienced the problem own PS3 Slim.
oOo ZOMBIE oOo on 29 Nov '11 said:
What annoys me is along with this disrespect of paying customers by bethesda by not releasing a finished product is that it is now common place from all gamemakers and product manufacturers is that they can sell and release unfinished products and rely on a patch or update to correct what should have been a finished job properly,it's like selling you a house without a roof...if it aint ready dont sell it as ready,there should be a law against it to protect consumers.
Paranoimia on 29 Nov '11 said:
I've no interest in Skyrim, thankfully... but I did love Fallout 3 despite the crippling lag you got later on, and particularly in the DLC.
I really wanted to play New Vegas, but after I learned it would use the same game engine, I flat out refused to buy it.
Sadly, as long as people keep buying these broken games, they'll keep churning them out. Vote with your wallets - either don't buy their games, or return them for a refund. That's they only way they'll take notice. They won't learn their lesson until you as consumers learn yours.
djreplay on 29 Nov '11 said:
I didn't buy it as it's not my normal sort of game but with the overwhelmingly positive reviews it got I was thinking about finding out what all the fuss was about, thank god I didn't.
PS More stuff from Tim Clark please, the only reason I used to buy OPM.
moogiesboy on 29 Nov '11 said:
Lol ... wot a numpty I am CVG.
I watched that and began to get enraged at the horrid lag on skrim. A times I stared in disbelief as the lag became so bad I couldn't see any movement at all!
...then I remembered I was watching on your horrid video player. Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer ....
stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter - stutter -
- buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer ....- buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer - buffer - Buffer - buffer -
But I must say; the sponser messages play great!
Down with robots on 29 Nov '11 said:
What baffles me is why it is so bad on PS3 and perfectly fine on Xbox, when they are both effectively running the same program logic, as both versions are identical aren't they? I don't have a PS3 or Skyrim but I'm still interested in this puzzle.
TheCrimsonFenix on 29 Nov '11 said:
Who knows with Bethesda.. I remember Fallout 3 on PS3 the week it came out, every time a notification would pop up for an friend to come online it would freeze the game for 5 seconds.
Bright-Light on 29 Nov '11 said:
I have a ps3 slim, and although im yet to start palying Skyrim, and i can say that fallout NV had the same problem as skyrim, the bigger my save file, the more the lag. To a point where i can only get 10 mins in before it crashes.
mind you my save file is soooooo huge!! Becuase i dotn like to miss out, i try and do every tiny thing in the game. I imaigine you will get zero lag if you dont stray to far from the main quest, but then why play rpg's if thats the only option to be lagless.
I told my lass to get me Skyrim for 360 for xmas, if she gets it for the PS3 im gonna smash her presents up with my feet.
Flamestrike on 29 Nov '11 said:
Reading other news sites the 360 version has had its own problems although not as bad, (apparently installing the game isn't recommended), but as this is an Xbox-centric site its not reported here.
shadowsblaze on 29 Nov '11 said:
There is - The Sales of Goods Act 1979. It entitles you to a full refund from where you bought the disk. Don't be put off by online retailer's or shop assistant's bull. If the game is not running as it's meant to, you are legally entitled to a refund. Any problems with the retailer, contact Trading Standards.
flash501 on 29 Nov '11 said:
Maybe CVG are somehow secretly behind this lag. You know, to make the 360 look better.
nigel666 on 29 Nov '11 said:
Quality Assurance, what the f**k were Bethesda and Sony's department's doing.
Sammy_bham on 29 Nov '11 said:
i must be the lucky one then guys.
played for 6 hours straight last night
no lag whatsoever.
didnt even lag before the patch for me. and after the patch it runs even better, no pop ups etc.
playing it right now, no issues, no lag, no reduction in textures.
86 hours in now, done multiple quests, gone to different places etc.
only thing i can think of is that i dont fast travel?
maybe you guys are "noobing" it up wth fast travel too much?
i dunno...
voodoo341 on 29 Nov '11 said:
100+ hours here and was playing without any issues last night. I do fast travel quite a bit but I'm dumping my saves to the cloud.
ricflair on 29 Nov '11 said:
Why do people consistently read sites they think are biased? Plus I'd be glad if problems are given greater coverage, regardless of platform, as long as they're genuine - it helps me work out if something is worth my money! This is a problem for Bethesda and is their fault, nobody's having a pop at the bloody PS3. Well some people might be, but not CVG by the looks of things.
The 360 issue has been reported, but, and lets not shout about it lest we offend, the PS3 issue (when it happens) is a much bigger issue, surely?
jim2wheels on 29 Nov '11 said:
Can those who have no issues state what ps3 they have - fatty or slim, change of hdd and so forth. I've got a 80gb fatty with a 7200 500gb hdd installed, if it's drive related I'd feel more confident that I'd be one of the lucky ones that doesn't have any issues.
DAEDALUS79 on 29 Nov '11 said:
Whilst this is annoying, its just impossible to hate the glitches, this one is superb!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idqelTGpb6s
flash501 on 29 Nov '11 said:
That's quite possibly the greatest thing I have ever seen!
deklore on 29 Nov '11 said:
Yknow you guys at CVG are just hypocrits. Okay this is Bethesdas fault, but where the F were you when you were reviewing the game??? I mean arent you meant to play at least more than a couple of hours before you review? If so then this problem should have been CLEARLY apparent for your review.
But no, its clear you never played the game properly before you reviewed it and now your jumping on the bandwagon, making lag videos etc just dumping on Bethesda. Where the F were those lag videos when you put the review out???? Shame on you CVG.
Mmmmgrolsch on 29 Nov '11 said:
I'm guessing they reviewed a 360 copy.
jim2wheels on 29 Nov '11 said:
http://www.rankopedia.com/CandidatePix/43170.gif
deklore on 29 Nov '11 said:
So they reviewed a 360 copy and copy and pasted the review for the PS3??
Thats just laziness. Being a game review site surely they know there are differences in different versions of the games? I mean look at Bayonetta. If they did it the way they were supposed to they wouldnt have released a review on the 360 and posted it as a review for the PS3.
Thats just unprofessional and just as bad.
superdynamite on 29 Nov '11 said:
My XBox360 copy lags, freezes and has major pop-ins from the surrounding environment. My XBox is brand new so it's definitely the fps. I'm on my 6th XBox!!! I guess it cannot process the info fast enough. I'm further into the game on my brother's PS3 and it runs as smooth as Motorstorm, Uncharted and God of War III.
Mmmmgrolsch on 29 Nov '11 said:
While I agree with you, it's just how they do it. I think both versions should always be played to make sure it doesn't have any extra issues or bugs etc. I think yeah the review of the game can be copy and pasted but technical issues especially Skyrim should be mentioned therefore they should play both versions.
Some review sites do review both copys though, although this seems only to be a select few at most from what I'm aware?
feeg86 on 29 Nov '11 said:
Have you tried tuning it on and off?
In all seriousness, my lady getting me this for Christmas for PS3 so I'm a little bit luckier that this patch might have sorted it on my 40gb fa PS3. I've got a 300gb hard drive in it some I'm crossing my fingers that'll be another deterrent.
It does p**s me off that this day in age there are little or no games without some sort of glitches. I know in the past games in the 16 bit and 8 bit generations had their glitches, but they were few and far between, not like today. Quality control is obviously non existent.
Metagen on 29 Nov '11 said:
Well now I'm glad I couldn't afford to pick it up right away. Could whoever is using it on PS3 and isn't having problems say what they're using and how old their PS3 is and also if they're using the PS+ cloud saving feature. My PS3 is only about 3 months old since my 60gb fat died (RIP) but I've put my own 500GB drive in it and I'll be using the cloud save feature. I don't care about the lag tbh as I'll be picking it up the first chance I get, although saying that it will probably be fixed by the time I get around to it haha.
Tbh, I've come to expect this of Bethesda. I've recently started playing through Fallout 3 again since it was so broken that I couldn't play any of the DLC when it was first released so I'm finally getting to do it now, so I'm occupied for the time being. Same goes with New Vegas, although I didn't really enjoy that as much as Fallout 3 and I never got around to finishing it.
Lady Gagagged on 29 Nov '11 said:
This is what, the third or fourth seriously effed up release from Bethseda on the PS3 that mongs buy in their millions. Here is a suggestion don't buy the next game and maybe they'll learn to stop releasing shoddy products. You keep buying them and they'll keep releasing them like this until you'll come to accept it. Grow a pair and say no.
feeg86 on 29 Nov '11 said:
Some people (myself included) don't have a choice of which console to buy the game on. People also trust in a game due to reviews, of which there was no mention whatsoever of issues.
Use your f*cking brain before commenting.
Lady Gagagged on 29 Nov '11 said:
Apart from the completely unnecessary insult at the end you do have my sympathies. I did overlook the fact that no review mentioned the problem, but as the article mentioned that this product shouldn't have gotten passed Bethseda's and Sony's Q&A departments. At no point did I attack those that purchased the game at launch just those that are still picking it up despite the well documented problems with it.
Maybe if you took the time to read the post, and asked for clarifacation on anything I didn't make entirely clear, instead of lazily hiding behind your circumstances. Tell me will you pick up the next Bethseda product at launch? Because if you say yes then I'll have no sympathy for you what so ever.
Sammy_bham on 29 Nov '11 said:
To the above, heres my stats and im having no issues "so far". ill say so far because i know of some people who are much futher and have suddenly got issues. and also know people who have got all trophies, and not had one issue (all ps3).
ive bought a new ps3 recently, slim 120gb. had it just over a month. (5 weeks).
ps3 slim 120gb
not much installed on it - no music, 3 small ps 1 games, no videos
ps plus with cloud saving enabled
87 hours into skyrim
i dont fast travel anywhere
I have used all the seperate save files (not sure why) and inow how to overide save games
i have seen all but one big town, explored about 50% of the map now
completed 8 main quests
25 misc quests
10 side quests
have 32 misc quests o/s
13 side quests o/s
smithed LOADS of weapons, got two houses, each of them are full of junk, have 9 shouts, 3 extra dragon souls..
not sure what else to tell you
hasnt crashed, hasnt slowed down, very minimal glitching, with the patch now its even smoother, no texture loss (im sure people are just seeing things or it hasnt "loaded up" yet). loving it.
CrazyPeter on 29 Nov '11 said:
Good luck with that, the Xbox copy has got equally annoying (but different) problems...
However we all know those reports get mostly buried by the Xbox loving gaming press.
horngreen on 29 Nov '11 said:
360_Fan on 29 Nov '11 said:
Thats funny. Can you imagine the amout of hits a site would get if it reported xbox version is suffering serious lag? They would be mad not to report it if it was true.
I would be interested to know what problems you are having though. I have only had the game freeze on 2 occasions personally, but that is certainly not unique to Skyrim. I have installed the game and it is running great.
Y2Ken on 30 Nov '11 said:
As a Kenneth myself I approve of your use of my name in this article, despite the odd context.
I'm still happy I bought the game on PS3, personally I prefer the DS3 enough over the Xbox pad to the point where I'll accept a few problems (not to say the 360 version is without issues). Ultimately it seems like the PC players got the best deal, which I guess makes sense but hopefully they can fix this permanently at some point because it's still nagging.
I believe this 1.2 patch fixes it, but there's an issue on Xbox where if you have the game installed then the game displays low-res textures in a large number of circumstances (basically the game looks a lot worse) - and obviously running uninstalled means long load times. That said it's nowhere near as big an issue as the PS3 lag one.
Windowlicker79 on 30 Nov '11 said:
Can you imagine the outrage if they decided that this game was so screwed up with glitches that they had to recall it?
If they've already released one patch for it which seems to have partially masked some problems whilst somehow creating all new problems then a full product recall could be a reality. Perhaps so much of the code on the disc is at fault that it simply can't be fixed with a patch? Obviously this would be a last resort for Bethesda, but there is only so long they can keep quiet about this. If the next (inevitable) patch doesn't fix it then I think they are going to have to come clean and speak out about just what went wrong.
Just found this list of known bugs. Unsurprisingly the first part of it talks about how they should sort the list as it has become so enormous that its impossible to find anything in its 400+ entries!!
http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:Bugs_%28Skyrim%29
snake2011 on 30 Nov '11 said:
not a problem for me yet played just over 50 hours on the PS3 version hope it stays away as well.
Flamestrike on 30 Nov '11 said:
Probably. Like secret code ninjas.
ricflair on 30 Nov '11 said:
I just don't like having to read the paranoid whingeing. I don't care about the site, they'll stir up anything for hits.
Terranova1 on 30 Nov '11 said:
Have to say i have had no lag issues playing on my PS3 slim, i'm level 26 about 30 hours or so in, save file is 6.5MB and yet plays fine even better with the patch, I have had it lock up on loading screens a couple of times though but as i say no lag.
I wonder what people are doing to get it i have auto save on etc , and a ton of quests in my list to do I dunno.
johnafirth on 30 Nov '11 said:
As much as I love Bethesda's games, their tendency to just say "good enough" and then rely on patches really annoys me. They're not the only ones, but that's hardly an excuse.
jaferris on 30 Nov '11 said:
i like the advert advertising the game before the video of the terrible lag
25+ hrs into the game havnt come across any terrible lag yet the odd wtf it doing be it passes and just carry on playing and enjoying the game
hi0marc on 30 Nov '11 said:
I'll buy it.
IF its properly patched before ME3.
That, is what i call a challenge, Bethesda.
Metagen on 30 Nov '11 said:
Out of curiosity, is anyone having problems with lag that IS using the cloud save feature?
V4.SKUNK on 30 Nov '11 said:
When you read all the PS3 reviews of Skyrim not one review mentions the game breaking bugs. Its a f**king joke and shows the state of journalism in the gaming industry, it shows that journalists don't actually play the games and if they did it was probably for f**king 2 hours.
Marky Mark on 30 Nov '11 said:
Here Here, well bloody said, hope you are listening Bethesda! Pull your fingers out and fix this (if you can) best game in ages otherwise!
Felly117 on 30 Nov '11 said:
Before this "improvement" my game had only crashed once. Now its crashed 3 times in 10 minutes
gundam on 4 Dec '11 said:
Is the size of the save file correlated with how many outstanding quests you have? I must admit I've been just telling all of those NPCs that I'll do their inane requests (you want me to give a piece of meat to a dog...seriously?) even with no intention of doing anything for them.