The Xbox 360 is at the forefront of high-definition entertainment with its cutting edge graphics and digital surround sound, and now - slowly but surely - the other fields of digital entertainment are taking their first step into the new high-definition era.
Although high-definition TV shows and movies are a fact of life in America via satellite and cable, only now is the UK beginning to catch up with HD offerings from Sky and Telewest, with the BBC also currently piloting their own free-to-air high-definition TV system in London.
In terms of 'buyable and rentable' movies, two disk formats are coming to market - HD-DVD and Blu-ray. The former's being backed by Microsoft and the influential DVD Forum, which rubber-stamps all DVD formats.
HD-DVD will be supported by the Xbox 360 in the form of an external optical disk unit that hooks up to the main console and uses the console's built-in HD processors to interpret the raw data supplied by the new drive.
The movies themselves look set to be the new reference standard for home cinema, far outstripping the MPEG2-based USA cable services and annihilating Sky HD in terms of audio and video fidelity. HD-DVD offers support for both high-definition video and audio, and what's more, the movies are encoded at 1920x1080 in progressive scan - again ensuring a higher level of quality up against the interlaced, compressed signal you get from Sky HD. Some Sky HD movies have even been transmitted with stereo soundtracks. This is nowhere near as high quality as the Dolby Digital Plus and TrueHD surround sound systems used by HD-DVD.
So what can HD-DVD do? What movies are available? Where does the Xbox 360 and its addon unit fit in? How will Blu-ray affect its chances? Read on for everything you need to know...
Q+A
HD-DVD drive tech confusion dispelled! At this year's E3, Microsoft took the wraps off its HD-DVD add-on drive, revealing this innocuous-looking box as well as giving rise to a raft of technical questions from people keen to get their hands on the latest piece of Xbox 360 kit. Like the main console, it can be stacked either vertically or horizontally, and it connects to the Xbox 360 via the USB connection. The most common technical questions are answered below:
Is USB fast enough to handle HD-DVD? The proof of the pudding is in the HD-DVD add-on itself. It works! But getting down to some technical aspects of the player, the highest bandwidth HD-DVD requires is around 30 megabytes per second. The USB 2.0 connection can handle a maximum data pull-through of double that, so there are no problems there.
Will there be any Xbox 360 games exclusive to HD-DVD? It's highly unlikely. There's no good reason to do it as the majority of Xbox 360 owners won't own the new drive. It would hit publishers in their pockets to make games available only to a minority of Xbox 360 gamers who've bought an add-on HD-DVD drive, excluding everyone else!
Don't you need an HDMI connection for HD-DVD movies? The Xbox 360 doesn't have one. As it happens, HD-DVD works just fine without the digital HDMI connection, providing an analogue high-definition picture through HD component connections. In theory, there's no reason why the Xbox 360's superb VGA cable can't be used either.
But what about the digital copy protection? Sadly, the movie studios are so paranoid about piracy that there has been talk of hobbling HD playback on the component output which would have a big impact on picture quality. This copy protection is referred to as ACSS. Happily, none of the studios have used it yet, and there is allegedly an agreement in place that it won't be used until 2012. It would be commercial suicide as HDTV has been around for a while in the USA, and none of the older HDTVs support HDMI. The 'hobbled' HD picture resolution would be 960x540 - not much better than a well-encoded PAL DVD, and a quarter of the 'full fat' display.
Will the Xbox 360 ever have an HDMI output? Microsoft has said it will launch HDMI output when the Xbox 360 user really needs it. Far be it for us to challenge the wisdom of their designers, but we've stripped down our Xbox 360 and have found little evidence that digital video is being generated by the machine. Perhaps Microsoft will manage to surprise us!
Does the lack of digital output reduce the quality of the picture? In theory, yes. In practise, no. The analogue component and VGA outputs of the Xbox 360 are of an incredibly high quality. On the current generation of flat-panel displays, the human eye physically can't tell the difference between analogue and digital HD sources. Users of the world's first HD-DVD player - the Toshiba HD-A01 - also note no discernable difference.
Will the Xbox 360 HD-DVD players picture quality be on a par with a dedicated player? For the moment, yes. The Xbox 360 is limited to a 1280x720 video output, which is around the same as most HDTVs available today. However, HD-DVD is encoded at a colossal 1920x1080, and all indications are that the Xbox 360 cannot match this resolution. It's not an issue if no HDTVs can either, but will be in future when the technology catches up. Whether the add-on will enable a full HD-DVD resolution 1920x1080 output from the Xbox 360 is unknown, but we'd say it is unlikely.
How much will the HD-DVD add-on cost? How much will the movies be? No official announcement has been made, but a cost of between £130 and £170 is likely. In contrast, the Toshiba HD-A01 dedicated player will cost around £350-£400. The HD-DVDs should be more expensive than current DVDs. Expect to pay £20 to £25 at the most - around the same as DVD when it launched. For a cheap way into the next generation of home cinema, you could invest in an Xbox 360 and the HD-DVD add-on - and still spend less than on a standalone player!
I don't what has happened here, but this piece of 'editorial' is really a piece of 'advertorial?' Every week this website is part of the bandwagon that slates Sony and Blu-ray and then this piece promoting HD in a separate box?!
CVG should clearly label a piece when it is sponsored directly (whether Microsoft, Sony or Nintendo) or indirectly via an official magazine.)
However, HD-DVD is encoded at a colossal 1920x1080, and all indications are that the Xbox 360 cannot match this resolution. It's not an issue if no HDTVs can either, but will be in future when the technology catches up.
This is utter rubbish. There are many HDTV's on the market right now that have 1080 lines. The idea that only having 720p might only become a problem 'in the future' is just more or less a total lie. It could be a problem today, if you have a nice enough TV. This article really is the worst kind of surruptitious advertising and spin. Shame on you C&VG! Shame!
Is everybody blind? When I click on the link to the story it clearly states that it is an OXM article. That's Offical Xbox Magazine so there's no suprise at all that the article will show an MS bias.
It should be pointed out that in addition to 720p, the 360 also outputs to 1080i, and if you have a TV capable of 1080p, it should also be good enough to do a decent job deinterlacing the 1080i image. Basically the movie is in 1080p on the disc, the drive, or the 360 converts that down to 1080i, but at twice the framerate, this is then reconverted at the TV end to 1080p at 24fps. The resolution is a non issue and the current dedicated HD-DVD drives do the same, but many are hailing it the best image quality ever, certainly better than anything on blu-ray.
It should be pointed out that in addition to 720p, the 360 also outputs to 1080i, and if you have a TV capable of 1080p, it should also be good enough to do a decent job deinterlacing the 1080i image. Basically the movie is in 1080p on the disc, the drive, or the 360 converts that down to 1080i, but at twice the framerate, this is then reconverted at the TV end to 1080p at 24fps. The resolution is a non issue and the current dedicated HD-DVD drives do the same, but many are hailing it the best image quality ever, certainly better than anything on blu-ray.
I'm no expert but I always thought that if you had a 1080p TV and you played 360 games on it it will display the games in 1080i. Inone frame 540 line are displayed half the picture, then the other 540 line are displayed the other half of the picture. So if the 360 sends a 1080i signal, why would the TV do 1080 line progressive? What would you say was better, seeing a 720progressive picture or a 1080 interlace picture. smaller LCD's output 1366 x 768 pixels so it must be better to use 720p right? These LCD's say they output 1080i and 1080i stands for resolution of 1920x1080 pixels but these TV's ony display 1366 x 768 pixels. So does the TV downscale the picture?
Blu-ray will output and display 1080p and also upscale current DVD's to 1080p according to the spec sheet. HD-DVD players will upscale DVD to 1080i according to the spec sheet. If 720p is better than 1080i (which I'm not sure of yet, only guessing) surely it's better to buy a Blu-ray player or PS3 if you plan on watching HD movies on mubh bigger screens.
Will Microsoft be releasing games on HD-DVD's? How will this effect 360 owners who do not wish to buy a add-on HD-DVD player? I have read about 360 getting exclusive downloadable contect for GTA IV. The reason the PS3 version won't is because it will be already be on the blu-ray disc. This is from what was said on IGN from The Darkness developers "Speaking of the PlayStation 3, 2K was very forthcoming during our demo when it came to discussing the benefits of the new system and how it would affect The Darkness. Because of the Blu-ray format, for example, Starbreeze plans to include additional videos that exploit the "television watching" feature which currently consists of the classic "Nosferatu" vampire silent film (in its entirety) and five 30-minute Popeye cartoons. The publisher isn't sure what the PS3-exclusive videos will be just yet, but we suggested an episode of Top Cow's old Witchblade TV series" Maybe Microsoft wants more contect in their games and as games on duel-layer DVD'd are compressed enough it's obvious they need more space. Maybe thwey will release a DVD version of a game and release a HD-DVD version of the same gaime fore people who want the extra content.
Is everybody blind? When I click on the link to the story it clearly states that it is an OXM article. That's Offical Xbox Magazine so there's no suprise at all that the article will show an MS bias.
Exactly. Read a PS2/3 mag and see how biased they are.
I'm no expert but I always thought that if you had a 1080p TV and you played 360 games on it it will display the games in 1080i. Inone frame 540 line are displayed half the picture, then the other 540 line are displayed the other half of the picture. So if the 360 sends a 1080i signal, why would the TV do 1080 line progressive?
Basically you have the movie encoded on the disc at 24fps progressive scan, the player, be that the Toshiba or the 360 addon can only output at 1080i. however it can output twice as quick, so it in effect splits one frame of progressive into 2 interlaced frames. When this signal reaches the TV, if you have a good deinterlacer, which if you can afford a 1080p set, you should have, the two interlaced frames are recombined to give you the original 24fps progressive image. It's explained a lot better elsewhere on the web, but that's the gist of it. I should say though that when considering games, things are different in that games aren't locked at 24fps like movies, and 60fps progressive on PS3 could not be countered by 120fps interlaced on xbox, they just won't do it.
What would you say was better, seeing a 720progressive picture or a 1080 interlace picture. smaller LCD's output 1366 x 768 pixels so it must be better to use 720p right? These LCD's say they output 1080i and 1080i stands for resolution of 1920x1080 pixels but these TV's ony display 1366 x 768 pixels. So does the TV downscale the picture?
Yeah, it totally depends on the set, if you have a 1080p set, and a choice of 720p or 1080i input, i've heard (though i don't have HDTV so i'm only repeating others) that 1080i is preferable for the reasons stated above, but in the UK, most TVs are not 1080p, so for many 720p is preferable. Also, most games are rendered at 720p, so to resize that would lead to some loss in quality, making 720p the better choice.
Blu-ray will output and display 1080p and also upscale current DVD's to 1080p according to the spec sheet. HD-DVD players will upscale DVD to 1080i according to the spec sheet. If 720p is better than 1080i (which I'm not sure of yet, only guessing) surely it's better to buy a Blu-ray player or PS3 if you plan on watching HD movies on mubh bigger screens.
As stated above, HD-DVD as it stands now, with the existing hardware on the market outputs at 1080i, but it doubles the frame rate, and the original source movie on both formats is in 1080p, so when the signal reaches that bigger screen, the screen will recombine the interlaced frames into a progressive frame anyway, making the picture *theoretically* identical.
One other point i would like to make is if anyone is unsure of this stuff, go to www.avsforum.com, there is wealth of info there, among which is this little gem: Blu-ray, as it stands now is a single layer 25GB disc. There are plans for a dual layer 50GB disc, but they are having problems producing them in decent quantities. HD-DVD is 30Gb dual layer NOW. Not only that, but all blu-ray movies to date in the US are encoded in MPEG2, which is the same standard as on DVD. Almost all titles on HD-DVD use a new standard called VC1, it allows the same picture quality in half the space, or put another way, twice the quality in the same space. Since the discs are currently larger and the encoding more sophisticated, HD-DVD is considered far superior to blu-ray at the current time.
On that basis, if both discs can do 1080p but one is twice the picture quality, which one are you gonna choose? I know what i would choose...
Will Microsoft be releasing games on HD-DVD's? How will this effect 360 owners who do not wish to buy a add-on HD-DVD player? I have read about 360 getting exclusive downloadable contect for GTA IV. The reason the PS3 version won't is because it will be already be on the blu-ray disc.
No, at present MS will not be releasing games on HD-DVD, the reasoning being they would split their users into two groups, HD-DVD and non HD-DVD, and also because it is deemed unnecessary to do that, all games so far are fitting onto DVD, why bump the cost up for no reason? As regards GTA4, i cannot deny what you have said, nor can i confirm it but i am aware of the exclusive content for 360, i would say it's because xbox has a marketplace for that, PS3 as yet does not...
This is from what was said on IGN from The Darkness developers "Speaking of the PlayStation 3, 2K was very forthcoming during our demo when it came to discussing the benefits of the new system and how it would affect The Darkness. Because of the Blu-ray format, for example, Starbreeze plans to include additional videos that exploit the "television watching" feature which currently consists of the classic "Nosferatu" vampire silent film (in its entirety) and five 30-minute Popeye cartoons. The publisher isn't sure what the PS3-exclusive videos will be just yet, but we suggested an episode of Top Cow's old Witchblade TV series" Maybe Microsoft wants more contect in their games and as games on duel-layer DVD'd are compressed enough it's obvious they need more space. Maybe thwey will release a DVD version of a game and release a HD-DVD version of the same gaime fore people who want the extra content.
Does any of that content add value though? it sounds like fluff to fill the space. If a game came out on PS3 that really used that 25GB, and it couldn't be compressed on to DVD, then maybe MS would reconsider, but i don't think it will. Look how many great games came out on Dreamcast on a 1GB disc, or on GC on a 1.8GB mini DVD, size is often not a barrier to good ideas, and if when it does start to be, we'll be talking about PS4 and Xbox 720 or whatever
I hope that I explained it well enough about the 1080i/1080p stuff, it's just that we're constantly told by Sony 1080p is not possible on HD-DVD, but for all intents and purposes it's a load of rubbish...
My Wii is going to entertain me for the next 10 years anyway, no need for other forms of entertainment
Dude im lookin forward to the Wii as much as the next guy, but 10 years? Seriously? You sound like a Sony exec....i'm sorry it needed to be said, fix up, look sharp and try and stay of the meth
I'm looking more and more at the Wii. PS3 at or anywhere near it's current price holds no interest in me, but seeing headlines like Wii being Ł90, or even Ł150 makes it a much more viable investment to me. I can't see myself playing it in 2016 (just say it! 2016, it'll be PS5 by then!) but while i initially vowed never to buy a machine named after a bodily function, i'm coming round to it. If the controls don't require too much effort (i do enough moving around at work to not need to do it at home also) then i think it could be very successful
a question for the fanboys. assuming that microsft are doing a good thing releasing the hd add on and not forcing it on the consumers, giving them a choice, then presumably there is no reason why they shouldnt release a blu ray drive add on.
a question for the fanboys. assuming that microsft are doing a good thing releasing the hd add on and not forcing it on the consumers, giving them a choice, then presumably there is no reason why they shouldnt release a blu ray drive add on.
ok, every1 listen up! the xbox360 is an xbox 1.5, its also about as next gen as my garndmother to boot!blu-ray, hd-dvd blah blah blah. hd-dvd will be better for movies i think, but lets be honest now and think about what im going to say here. as far as disc formats go, blu-ray is the CLEAR winner. due to its size, the blu-ray disc will hold gta 4 plus all the content you have to pay for and download (onto a poxy 20gb hard-drive might i add) for the 360 via xbox live. now if this is going to be the case for most of the multi-format releases, and people are still whinging about the price of ps3, how much more (over time) will 360 owners be paying just to get their games anywhere near as large or complete as what they will be on the ps3 blu-ray format? the ps3, although expensive for the unit, will be much better value for money than the 360! its got everything- hdmi connection, dh-dvd compatibilty (out of the box too, i might add) 1080p hd (which is the best resolution you can get- ignore any silly posts above that say otherwise), wi-fi connectivity and of course, a 60gb hard drive too. ud have to fork out about Ł240 on 360 hdd units to get that many gigabytes- if u bought the core version that is. plus Ł120(ish) on a hd-dvd drive.
so basically, to get a 360 anywhere near the spec of a ps3 (which will still be a much more powerful machine regardless) u have to fork out about Ł560!!!
all u xbox fanboys whingeing about the ps3 price can now shut up and feel VERY stupid indeed!
its actually Ł200 for the hd dvd drive wich would push it to Ł640. i dont get the 360 fanboys cos we all know its true but undoubtedly they'll now argue against the facts.
These are posts i get really annoyed about. One point I quickly want to make is i am no 360 fanboy. I never plan to buy one(or a PS3 for that matter) but i feel inclined to stand up for it when a Sony fanboy(the term is used a lot, but for you i am sure it is the correct one) has a rant like that. Many major developers are saying that the Blu ray disc will be disastorus for Sony, as the cost of manufactoring it will be too high. There may well be a clear winner in this next gen race but to say that
all u xbox fanboys whingeing about the ps3 price can now shut up and feel VERY stupid indeed!
is crazy. Nothing has changed about the whole Blu Ray situation in the past weeks so why would they all of a sudden think they are wrong, with no new evidence to prove it? It will be a close war, of that i am sure, but to pronounce that all of a sudden the PS3 is going to walk away with the title of best next gen console is insane. Oh, and a main point of your post was assuming people had bought core machienes, but since the premium version is still significantly cheaper than the PS3 it was a strange choice to make. Can anyone tell me if you can hook up external hard drives to your 360? (Other than the one made for it, obviously) because if you can, your figures are all wrong there too. Annnnnndddddddd rant over.
I thought that 'ud have to fork out about Ł240 on 360 hdd units to get that many gigabytes' was absolute rubbish, considering that 60Gb is a small hard drive in computing terms. So to have a HD almost 3 times the size of the PS3 and since we are talking about the Core version, you would still save Ł155 from the PS3. WOW! I'm sure all those xbox fanboys are feeling VERY stupid now
a question for the fanboys. assuming that microsft are doing a good thing releasing the hd add on and not forcing it on the consumers, giving them a choice, then presumably there is no reason why they shouldnt release a blu ray drive add on.
There is more reasoning behind MS not supporting blu-ray than Sony being a competitor, though obviously it makes sense.
MS as you should all know makes Windows, and the direction MS sees windows going in is as a Home hub, sort of like the centre of everything your home electronics goes through, so TV, radio, internet, games etc. Part of this is obviously movie playback, but there are differences in what blu-ray and HD-DVD allow. The specifications on HD-DVD make it mandatory that all movies can be copied in some way (it's called mandatory managed copy, or MMC for short) MMC means that MS can have a movie copied onto the PC, for playback anywhere else on the network, so to the PC, the 360, and if it was set up right, any telly in your house. Blu-ray do not allow this and it is the primary reason among others why MS won't do a blu-ray drive unless HD-DVD is killed off, and also why when you get Windows Vista in 12 months time or so, you can put an HD-DVD in an HD-DVD drive in a PC, and it will play. You can put a Blu-ray disc in a blu-ray drive in Vista, and without 3rd party software, it will NOT play, because MS do not support blu-ray as a whole, not just not on 360
its actually Ł200 for the hd dvd drive wich would push it to Ł640. i dont get the 360 fanboys cos we all know its true but undoubtedly they'll now argue against the facts.
Where is this Ł200 tag said? I don't get Sony fanboys sometimes...
As for the 360 not being able to output 1080p... Is this actually a design constraint or a choice? I don't understand how simply outputting a native 1080p60 signal would be impossible given the high end gpu it has. Obviously it's stupid to make games for 1080p rather than 720p this generation, which is probably why they limited the output thus far to 720p/1080i... but I'd love to know what's PHYSICALLY stopping the system from outputting at 1080p.
but I'd love to know what's PHYSICALLY stopping the system from outputting at 1080p.
Yes, it physically can't output a single frame at 1920x1080, however it can output 1920x540 at twice the framerate, and have the TV (and if you have a 1080p display, it must be high end, and if it's high end, it'll probably have a decent deinterlacer built in) recombine every 2 interlaced frames into 1 1080p frame. The real question is can PS3 output anything decent at 1080p? I personally think for all but the simplest games, 1080p won't be easy to pull off at a decent framerate and most devs will go for 720p instead, because anyone with HDTV will have 720p, but few will own 1080p sets for some time
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all that effort...wasted
