A document obtained from a motion seeking to take Microsoft to court alleged that the platform holder was fully aware that the Xbox 360 could scratch game discs beyond repair. It adds that Microsoft knew of the issue before the console was released, and that the firm did not move to address the hardware fault.
Plaintiffs in the US District Court case are seeking class-action status on behalf of all those who bought Xbox 360s. They allege that, when the 360 is spinning a game disc, even the slightest nudge of the console can lead to irreparable damage to the media.
Information from motion, which hopes to take Microsoft to a Civil Court over the allegations, is unsealed and publicly available in one document. It is this document which quotes internal Microsoft staff admitting that the 360's tendency to scratch discs in certain situations was known months before the console's worldwide launch.
The document quotes Hiroo Umeno, a Microsoft program manager, who says that "this is ... information that we as a team, optical disc drive team, knew about. When we first discovered the problem in September or October [2005], when we got a first report of disc movement, we knew this is what's causing the problem."
As the motion states, Microsoft then took a team of engineers to sample the console in stores across the US as it was being released to "investigate complaints that the Xbox 360 was routinely scratching discs during demonstrations." The team confirmed that a nudge or tilt to the console would collide the disc with the console's optical pick-up, thus leaving damaging scars on the media.
The motion then alleges that Microsoft then considered three options to fix the problem to the console. One was to increase the magnetic field of the disc holder, another was to slow the disc drive's 7,500 RPM speed, another was to install small bumpers.
Microsoft eventually rejected all these ideas, the motion states. The magnetic field would have interfered with the disc tray open/close switch, whereas slowing the disc's drive speed would have slowed loading times, and bumpers would have cost the company up to $75m.
Instead, Microsoft operated a disc replacement scheme for its own published software (costing consumers $20 each), and included a warning message on the game manual and to the disc drive: "Remove discs before moving the console or tilting it between the horizontal and vertical positions." The motion states that Microsoft employees suggested in an internal e-mail that the warning was insufficient.
Microsoft has received more than 55,000 complaints about scratched discs as of April this year.
The documentation can be read in full (via a large pdf) here.
I do find this incredibly shoddy - whether they knew about at launch or not, it's still something that can happen if you move the console....and that's after how many variations of the 360?
I've always been very careful to not let it happen to any of my games, but I can't think of any CD or DVD drive that I've ever had to worry about previously.
Hell, I could probably unclip my DVD drive from my PC, juggle with it and still not cause any damage to a CD inside.
See, this is what I said in a post before for some other article. My Elite scratched my Gears 2 disc on its own accord but Ms**te have the cheek to ask for money to get it fixed. Their own f***ing laziness causes this problem and yet the consumer has to pay?? This is absurd!
The machine may have some good games but on the whole the console and company itself are utter s**te and I won't be buying another MS console after this cos their service stinks as well as their console. Nintendo will hopefully got their ass into gear and will be bringing us a HD console next time around...
Oh yes, and my Elite was only less than three weeks old. And I'd moved my downloaded licenses to the machine which now was a waste of time as I can only do it once a year. Ms**te love to make things awkward for their customer. I can only access those downloads when I'm online now and have to wait till November of next year until I can do it again. Try telling that to their phone people and they seem to have no idea what you're talking about
See, this is what I said in a post before for some other article. My Elite scratched my Gears 2 disc on its own accord but Ms**te have the cheek to ask for money to get it fixed. Their own f***ing laziness causes this problem and yet the consumer has to pay?? This is absurd!
The machine may have some good games but on the whole the console and company itself are utter s**te and I won't be buying another MS console after this cos their service stinks as well as their console. Nintendo will hopefully got their ass into gear and will be bringing us a HD console next time around...
this is so retarded, its typical retarded american bulls**t...just like that lady who sued macdonalds for spilling hot coffee all over herself, theres a simple soultion; expect the expected, dont tilt your f**kin xbox when its on, stupid fools!
If the allegations prove well founded then this is highly deplorable behaviour on Microsoft's behalf. It doesn't exactly surprise me and this, amongst some other issues, is a large part of what keeps me from buying an Xbox 360 (just as too high a price for the PS3 is what keeps me from buying that, and the Wii strikes me as a bit simplistic for my overall personal gaming tastes - for party games it may well be superb). Hence why I love my PC (and the fact that it packs more punch and allows me much more freedom with the games and many different task options).
Anywho, before this thread completely implodes like the recent Sony PS3 threads I'd like to extend my sympathies to those Xbox owners that have been burnt by this phenomenon. It occurs to me that they are getting just as raw a deal as PC users are from DRM. There are still people that question whether government supervision is needed; well, *this* is why. The state has its issues too but by having Group A watch Group B while Group B watches Group C and Group C watches Group A perhaps we can get a somewhat functioning system where multi-national corporations aren't left to their own devices which often have little or no incentive to behave ethically if there is no threat of reprisal. Conversely the courts and government shouldn't be left unchecked either to stiffle everything in bureaucracy and "big brother" initiatives. Whatever the case at the end of the day the outcome is the same: The common citizens get to foot the bill.
buy cheap buy twice!!!!!! this is what you get when you buy hardware from a software company lol. cheap tat thats all i will say
Funnily enough MS hardware is generally excellent. I've had my MS keyboard and Intellimouse Explorer for the best part of 10 years now and they're still working perfectly.
No offence to anyone who says their disks have been scratched...but you have to be f**king retarded to move you're console while it's on. Do you people also flip DVD players upside down while they are playing? Seriously? What bottom hits their Xbox or nudges it while it's on?
On the other hand though Xbox 360s are cheaply designed. The original Xbox was built like a battle tank. Nothing could destroy that beast!
the very first day i got mine, my old dear nudged it in passing and the f**ker mauled the disc. just a very little brush past it and the disc jumps out the tray and goes berserk. poor deisgn. from a console all about poor design.
Or how MS raped your mother and killed your father. or they wouldn't of if captain sony hadn't fended the brigand off!!!
Seriously man... what university did you go to?
Which school did Crimbo go to? Was he "board" there too? It's easy enough to bring out the spelling police. I've done it myself in the past and I do think that it's important as it can decrease miscommunication, etc. However, I think in both of the instances witnessed above we were able to grasp the overall intended meaning. How about we get back to grilling Microsoft for dropping a big, steaming pile of turd on the public, hmm?
No offence to anyone who says their disks have been scratched...but you have to be f**king retarded to move you're console while it's on. Do you people also flip DVD players upside down while they are playing? Seriously? What bottom hits their Xbox or nudges it while it's on?
On the other hand though Xbox 360s are cheaply designed. The original Xbox was built like a battle tank. Nothing could destroy that beast!
it scratched mine disc during play, console was standing stil, no earthquakes etc, just loud noise and the disc was f**ked.
No offence to anyone who says their disks have been scratched...but you have to be f**king retarded to move you're console while it's on. Do you people also flip DVD players upside down while they are playing? Seriously? What bottom hits their Xbox or nudges it while it's on?
On the other hand though Xbox 360s are cheaply designed. The original Xbox was built like a battle tank. Nothing could destroy that beast!
Fair point; I agree that it seems unwise to make sudden movement changes in an active drive of any sort. Yet that isn't the main point; the main point is this: Microsoft was aware of this issue before release of the product and they even went so far as to research possible solutions. Microsoft then willfully chose to ignore their own team's recommendations despite opinions being expressed that simply providing a written warning wasn't sufficient. To top it off the replacement scheme adds insult to injury by asking for extra money to replace gaming discs from Microsoft (what about gaming discs from other publishers?). That is quite possibly criminal.
dear god a typo. I must have never had any kind of education if i don't proof read every last comment i make on the internet.
I went to Lampeter, its the oldest and best uni in Wales,
I'm guessing your currently studying for your masters in anal retentive w****ry. Think you're gonna get a 1st mate!
It's not a typo it's poor grammer. It makes you look like you went to the school for kids who can't read too good.
Grammar.
Oh, and I don't know if you are being ironic (though i suspect the concept is lost on you) but 'kids who can't read too good' is terrible grammar.
If you're going to be pedantic, don't then make yourself look like a tit at the same time by typing like a c**kney in an argument.
"them kids what don't read too good"
Anyway, I've never had my 360 scratch a disc, but it isn't a problem now you can install your game to your hard drive with NXE. Though I admit that if this was the case, I'd want a replacement game straight away.
The people trying to take this court are the same types of people who are the cause for some of the plain stupid warnings on product labels. One of the best I seen was on a Hairdryer "Do not use while taking a shower"
It baffles belief.
Mind you, if it was a known problem, then MS should have got it sorted. I hope that they learn their lessons for the next Xbox.
Is anyone really surprised by this? We all knew they rushed the console out, and that the RRoD was a by-product of those actions, it comes as no surprise to me that disc scratching is another.
It's probably only a matter of time before another creeps out of the woodwork too.
I don't know, I'm sure you can ask him. He'll be here soon no doubt.
Then let me ask you the same thing: Which school/university did you go to?
oxford
If true then he should have little trouble proving it with an authentic diploma (unless it was somehow lost or destroyed which is exceedingly poor form as you are issued a letter that informs the recipient that the diplomas can be difficult to replace), as well as being cross referenced in the university's alumni database.
He still got you on the "grammer" spelling. Payback's a bitch, eh?
Watch the film...
I did. Was not in a laughing mood the first time I watched it. Saw it again half a year later and was rolling with laughter. The gas station "water" fight scene (unhappy ending though,) as well as when they are messing around with the computer to Strauss's "Also Sprach Zarathusta". Hahahaha!
Then let me ask you the same thing: Which school/university did you go to?
Went to Queens in Belfast, yourself?
didn't go to uni but i did find a diploma in a bin
you see
That's lovely, that is! Second time I've been misquoted in a span of a few days. Both times my original text has been altered. Cheap thrills and all that, eh Crimbo?
Then let me ask you the same thing: Which school/university did you go to?
Went to Queens in Belfast, yourself?
didn't go to uni but i did find a diploma in a bin
you see
That's lovely, that is! Second time I've been misquoted in a span of a few days. Both times my original text has been altered. Cheap thrills and all that, eh Crimbo?
i don't know what you are talking about
Playing dumb as well, now, Crimbo? Or isn't it an act?
Then let me ask you the same thing: Which school/university did you go to?
Went to Queens in Belfast, yourself?
Undergraduate Bachelor's degree: Whittier College in California, USA.
Postgraduate Master's degree: University of Aberdeen, Scotland.
He is a disease to these forums man, you're better off trying to ignore him. Even Gav said to me yesterday 'is he being a pain again'... AGAIN? Yeesh...
Then let me ask you the same thing: Which school/university did you go to?
Went to Queens in Belfast, yourself?
Undergraduate Bachelor's degree: Whittier College in California, USA.
Postgraduate Master's degree: University of Aberdeen, Scotland.
He is a disease to these forums man, you're better off trying to ignore him. Even Gav said to me yesterday 'is he being a pain again'... AGAIN? Yeesh...
No offence to anyone who says their disks have been scratched...but you have to be f**king retarded to move you're console while it's on. Do you people also flip DVD players upside down while they are playing? Seriously? What bottom hits their Xbox or nudges it while it's on?
On the other hand though Xbox 360s are cheaply designed. The original Xbox was built like a battle tank. Nothing could destroy that beast!
No offence you f**king retard?
You do not need to move your 360 for it to scratch your discs,can you understand that you f**king Spastic.
I bumped into my PS2 years ago and it scratched my SSX disk, surely they should have replaced my game then?
Any idiot will tell you that moving something with a spinning CD/DVD/Bluray in it is up there with invading Russia in the Autumn on the scale of dumb ideas.
No offence to anyone who says their disks have been scratched...but you have to be f**king retarded to move you're console while it's on. Do you people also flip DVD players upside down while they are playing? Seriously? What bottom hits their Xbox or nudges it while it's on?
No offence you f**king retard?
You do not need to move your 360 for it to scratch your discs,can you understand that you f**king Spastic.
All the more reason not to be a tool and move it. Only adds to the already-present possibility of it scratching the disc. It's not rocket science!
Undergraduate Bachelor's degree: Whittier College in California, USA.
Postgraduate Master's degree: University of Aberdeen, Scotland.
Good Uni Aberdeen. Did my Masters at Queens as well then needed to get a job to pay the debt.
I have many fond memories of the "Granite City" and the Univ. of Aberdeen. The Scots strike me as a tough yet friendly lot.
How did the enjoy the Winters up here? Ultra cold at the moment....
I lived close by the university campus so even when there was frost and snow it wasn't too bad to walk. I found the snow on a quiet day off cosy, but the wind that would build up along the city streets was fierce, cold and had a bite. I don't suppose hugging the coast to the North Sea helped matters much.
MS have shafted us again on the console in terms of scratching discs. I borrowed Halo when I first got my 360, my housemate turned it on it's side and bingo!! It was ruined, it looked like someone had taken a compass to the bloody thing. I complained to MS and of course they had themselves covered by telling me "it does say not to move it with a disc inside". I take the disc out even when moving it while switched off now.
Someone, somewhere once told me it's the laser that scratches it and they could've have fixed it by just putting some kind of protective soft casing on it. I really hope MS have learned from their mistakes in the design process for the next gen.
I didn't go to university, sometimes I think it would've been nice but hey, you live by the decisions you make when you're 18 don't you?!?! But on the plus side I learned common sense, grammar, punctuation etc way before I left high school!
That's not to say I don't occasionally slip up or make a typo. We can't legislate for the odd brain short circuit! Don't be a pedant over a couple of mistakes on an internet forum - it's not big and certainly not clever (which kind of defeats the point of the criticism!).
Undergraduate Bachelor's degree: Whittier College in California, USA.
Postgraduate Master's degree: University of Aberdeen, Scotland.
Good Uni Aberdeen. Did my Masters at Queens as well then needed to get a job to pay the debt.
I have many fond memories of the "Granite City" and the Univ. of Aberdeen. The Scots strike me as a tough yet friendly lot.
How did the enjoy the Winters up here? Ultra cold at the moment....
I lived close by the university campus so even when there was frost and snow it wasn't too bad to walk. I found the snow on a quiet day off cosy, but the wind that would build up along the city streets was fierce, cold and had a bite. I don't suppose hugging the coast to the North Sea helped matters much.
Undergraduate Bachelor's degree: Whittier College in California, USA.
Postgraduate Master's degree: University of Aberdeen, Scotland.
Good Uni Aberdeen. Did my Masters at Queens as well then needed to get a job to pay the debt.
I have many fond memories of the "Granite City" and the Univ. of Aberdeen. The Scots strike me as a tough yet friendly lot.
How did the enjoy the Winters up here? Ultra cold at the moment....
I lived close by the university campus so even when there was frost and snow it wasn't too bad to walk. I found the snow on a quiet day off cosy, but the wind that would build up along the city streets was fierce, cold and had a bite. I don't suppose hugging the coast to the North Sea helped matters much.
You should try living on the very North coast.
The sheep keep us warm though.
Ehehehe! Aye, them farmers sure do like their sheep. Northern Scotland: Where men are men and sheep are scared. (Note: Poor grammar intentional)
I didn't go to university, sometimes I think it would've been nice but hey, you live by the decisions you make when you're 18 don't you?!?! But on the plus side I learned common sense, grammar, punctuation etc way before I left high school!
Ditto. While my friends were at Uni, I had a job, a car, and money... You take the good with the bad eh?
As they are doing no better in their careers as I am now, I would suggest that I got cash and stuff in place of the tail I would have gotten had I gone to Uni... Not sure I made the right choice sometimes...
I didn't go to university, sometimes I think it would've been nice but hey, you live by the decisions you make when you're 18 don't you?!?! But on the plus side I learned common sense, grammar, punctuation etc way before I left high school!
Ditto. While my friends were at Uni, I had a job, a car, and money... You take the good with the bad eh?
As they are doing no better in their careers as I am now, I would suggest that I got cash and stuff in place of the tail I would have gotten had I gone to Uni... Not sure I made the right choice sometimes...
I didn't go to university, sometimes I think it would've been nice but hey, you live by the decisions you make when you're 18 don't you?!?! But on the plus side I learned common sense, grammar, punctuation etc way before I left high school!
Ditto. While my friends were at Uni, I had a job, a car, and money... You take the good with the bad eh?
As they are doing no better in their careers as I am now, I would suggest that I got cash and stuff in place of the tail I would have gotten had I gone to Uni... Not sure I made the right choice sometimes...
I didn't go to university, sometimes I think it would've been nice but hey, you live by the decisions you make when you're 18 don't you?!?! But on the plus side I learned common sense, grammar, punctuation etc way before I left high school!
Ditto. While my friends were at Uni, I had a job, a car, and money... You take the good with the bad eh?
As they are doing no better in their careers as I am now, I would suggest that I got cash and stuff in place of the tail I would have gotten had I gone to Uni... Not sure I made the right choice sometimes...
"The worlds full of educated fools"
Am I an uneducated genius then?
Its only a Quote,take from it what you will.
I personally would love to go back to Uni and learn to become a games developer,instead i just go home and sit on my lazy ass and escape into the videogame worlds someone else has created for me.
Education is only a facilitator of knowledge, it is not necessarily an indication of intelligence, something people tend not to realise,.
I also have a first class degree and a masters, though this in no way makes me feel superior to someone who has not got a university education. People who tend to use this as some kind of basis of superiority tend to be the ignorant and unintelligent ones…
Education is only a facilitator of knowledge, it is not necessarily an indication of intelligence, something people tend not to realise,.
I also have a first class degree and a masters, though this in no way makes me feel superior to someone who has not got a university education. People who tend to use this as some kind of basis of superiority tend to be the ignorant and unintelligent ones…
People who tend to use this as some kind of basis of superiority tend to be the ignorant and unintelligent ones…
Ignorant, yes, but not (usually) unintelligent. Bugs me to hell when people have a superiority complex - expecially when I'm sat there thinking 'what the chuff do you have to be smug about'.
People who tend to use this as some kind of basis of superiority tend to be the ignorant and unintelligent ones…
Ignorant, yes, but not (usually) unintelligent. Bugs me to hell when people have a superiority complex - expecially when I'm sat there thinking 'what the chuff do you have to be smug about'.
Well it’s possibly because you use phrases like “what the chuff” akin to some kind of Railway Children reject. I am of course having a little jest here. Though I would much more appreciate the usage of the exclamation “cripes”, and perhaps, to a lesser extent, “blimey”, not used enough in these stab happy times if you ask me.
Superiority complexes will always tend to stem from the person feeling inadequate about another aspect of their persona. Quite possibly having a very small winky.
Well it’s possibly because you use phrases like “what the chuff” akin to some kind of Railway Children reject.
I only use phrases like these because I swear, I like swearing a lot. And swearing here is censored, so I 'self censor'. That said, I liberally sprinkle odd phrases like this into my everyday conversations - it amuses me. Saying things like 'toodle pip', if delivered well, can be highly amusing
I am of course having a little jest here. Though I would much more appreciate the usage of the exclamation “cripes”, and perhaps, to a lesser extent, “blimey”, not used enough in these stab happy times if you ask me.
I do use Blimey. Cripes, on the other hand, I try to avoid because it always reminds me of Penfold of Danger Mouse fame. That then makes me think of the show. And then the theme tune. Dammit.
Superiority complexes will always tend to stem from the person feeling inadequate about another aspect of their persona. Quite possibly having a very small winky.
Smallwinky syndrome? Isn't that when you fall in love with your kidnappers? (yes, I can do high brow jokes too)
'crivens' conker i think you've hit the preverbial nail on the head. I on the otherhand got a 2.2 at uni. what i like to think of as a drinking mans degree.
Got more out of uni than letters after my name. Cool stories and the best group of friends a guy could have.
thinking of going back and doing an MA in something somewhere though.
'crivens' conker i think you've hit the preverbial nail on the head. I on the otherhand got a 2.2 at uni. what i like to think of as a drinking mans degree.
We like to call those a 'Desmond' round these parts.
'crivens' conker i think you've hit the preverbial nail on the head. I on the otherhand got a 2.2 at uni. what i like to think of as a drinking mans degree.
Got more out of uni than letters after my name. Cool stories and the best group of friends a guy could have.
thinking of going back and doing an MA in something somewhere though.
I would also call it a Desmond.
I would very much agree that the most valuable things that I gained from my time at both universities were indeed the friends I made, my degree is not in anyway pertinent to what I do as a job, but I will still have much email banter with my chums. Rarstclart.
He still got you on the "grammer" spelling. Payback's a bitch, eh?
Watch the film...
I try to avoid most things with Ben Stiller in. Last good thing he did was Something About Mary...
Then you're missing out. Stuff like Zoolander, Night at the Museum, Meet the Parents, Tropic Thunder, even Starsky and Hutch are all entertaining enough. And then there's Dodgeball, which is frikkin' hilarious.
i never had serious scratches yet (elite) but it does once in a while litter a disc with light scratches for no reason (disc is still fully functional) which is a bummer since i keep all my favourite games in mint condition.
not surprised hes in a bad mood, crimbo only comes once a year
i hate christmas
what an ironic name you have then!
@ Marty - Explin 'Desmond'? is it another guy in the office you are working in?
There is no way you went to University got a 2:2 and never heard it called a Desmond.
Why not. that particular expression must not have made it to rural Wales.
If you ever went to where i went to uni you'd understand.
Well if Wales will not provide you with the common slang feel free to feast upon this bounty:
A first is commonly known as either a Geoff Hurst or a Damien Hirst, what would be the defining option for you probably defines more your interests in life or perhaps your degree, it is one of the wonders of life.
A Third is either known as a Douglas hurd or a Thora Hird, perhaps either of which is dependant on your love of old politicians or actresses.
Also, a 2:2 is also very much widely known as a drinkers degree.
i never had serious scratches yet (elite) but it does once in a while litter a disc with light scratches for no reason (disc is still fully functional) which is a bummer since i keep all my favourite games in mint condition.
Nor I, though I have just bought a new one so that may change, but hopefully not.
I try to avoid most things with Ben Stiller in. Last good thing he did was Something About Mary...
No way man... Zoolander is a gem of a film. It's like the old Simpsons in that every time you watch it you spot another joke.
I love the fact that cast Owen Wilson as the opposing super model - and he is clearly fugly. Actually fairly true to life really, as there are no end of 'super models' that are repulsive. Little more than walking clothes horses in fact. With about as much meat on 'em.
People who tend to use this as some kind of basis of superiority tend to be the ignorant and unintelligent ones…
Ignorant, yes, but not (usually) unintelligent. Bugs me to hell when people have a superiority complex - expecially when I'm sat there thinking 'what the chuff do you have to be smug about'.
Well it’s possibly because you use phrases like “what the chuff” akin to some kind of Railway Children reject. I am of course having a little jest here. Though I would much more appreciate the usage of the exclamation “cripes”, and perhaps, to a lesser extent, “blimey”, not used enough in these stab happy times if you ask me.
Superiority complexes will always tend to stem from the person feeling inadequate about another aspect of their persona. Quite possibly having a very small winky.
May be true in some cases. Personally I am proud of the fact that I have achieved the education that I have. However, I didn't do it on my own; my family extended generous support throughout the journey and it's anyone's guess how many people I encountered along the way who helped and inspired in one way or another (who knows, maybe I was able to do the same for someone else somewhere along the road?). You are right on the money about education being a facilitator of knowledge and skills yet not indicative of intelligence. That said, intelligence to some degree will be required unless you are a savant in the chosen field of study and/or relied on somewhat dubious means of graduating (which can lead to a debate as to whether that person has truly graduated or not. Physically yes; symbolically and in spirit, probably not).
I've encountered people at university whom didn't strike me as particularly bright and vice versa with people without university degrees. That said, I've also noticed that there are occassions where some people without a university degree belittle the value of having one. It won't magically open up all "doors" (which I used to think in my naivete,) yet it does give you a key to unlock many "doors" that would otherwise be inaccessible (ex. many government, EU and UN posts require university degrees and years of experience). I only tend to take offense when someone is insulting the degrees I have earned due to their own inadequacy at not having earned one (which nicely brings us a complete circle going from superiority complex to inferiority complex).
I only tend to take offense when someone is insulting the degrees I have earned due to their own inadequacy at not having earned one (which nicely brings us a complete circle going from superiority complex to inferiority complex).
I won't disagree with much of what you have said, but to suggest someone doesn't have a degree because of their own inadequacies is simply wrong. Personally, I opted to work rather than go to Uni. Does that make me inadequate? I have no doubt I could have gotten a degree had I actually bothered with Uni (whether I'd have gotten a *good* degree or not is another matter).
For the record, I don't feel inferior to those with degrees either - why should I? They chose to gain further education, I didn't. They are no superior to me than I am of them - we just made different choices along the way.
the very first day i got mine, my old dear nudged it in passing and the f**ker mauled the disc. just a very little brush past it and the disc jumps out the tray and goes berserk. poor deisgn. from a console all about poor design.
I only tend to take offense when someone is insulting the degrees I have earned due to their own inadequacy at not having earned one (which nicely brings us a complete circle going from superiority complex to inferiority complex).
I won't disagree with much of what you have said, but to suggest someone doesn't have a degree because of their own inadequacies is simply wrong. Personally, I opted to work rather than go to Uni. Does that make me inadequate? I have no doubt I could have gotten a degree had I actually bothered with Uni (whether I'd have gotten a *good* degree or not is another matter).
For the record, I don't feel inferior to those with degrees either - why should I? They chose to gain further education, I didn't. They are no superior to me than I am of them - we just made different choices along the way.
Nor should you feel inadequate, in my opinion. I did not state that someone who didn't go to university is inadequate. What I was referring to are the times when an individual has disparaged earning a degree because they apparently held a grudge at not having earned one for themselves. Personally I am of the opinion that education on just about any level can benefit just about any person. Just as there are different ways of thinking and different talents so too are there different ways of learning and different types of schools. Some people may fare better with abstract theories while others find hands-on practical tutoring more to their taste. It takes all sorts to make the world we live in, and so as far as I'm concerned what's really at the heart of the matter is that a person finds something that they enjoy, study and practice it in order to progress in that area or field of expertise whatever it may be (criminal undertakings excluded...although then we have careers such as secret agents, etc. whom I suspect at times get up to all sorts of dangerous, brutal and unpleasant things. Ah well, "In the name of the state and security", etc. Guess sometimes hard decisions are called for to deal with hard situations and hard people).
I think everyone should have the opportunity to gain access to an education based not upon their wealth or social status but rather upon their desire and ability. Meritocracy (and no, I do not support those arcane aptitude tests that were once used in the UK - and which are still used in some countries today - to determine whom goes to university and whom doesn't all before the age of 17,) where support is extended to encourage and aid people attain their goals and dreams for a constructive and fulfilling role in a larger society.
Seriously, companies have been doing crap like this for years. When a problem comes up they try to determine whether it'd cost more to fix it than deal with an eventual lawsuit. I've had my 360 for more than a year now and haven't ever had cause to move it/tilt it.
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